interesting shot slo-motion film

Playing advice / tips / Rules
Post here if you need help from the experts!
User avatar
oldman
Posts: 139
Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2006 5:50 pm
Real Name: Dominic Evans
Location: Winchester, Hampshire, UK

Post by oldman » Mon Jun 18, 2007 3:22 pm

cool, the full 1080i, h264 MP Level 4.1 would be nice if the filesize doesn't get too big :-)

User avatar
tom_k
Site Administrator
Posts: 854
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2003 9:32 am
Real Name: Tom King
Location: Oxford

Post by tom_k » Mon Jun 18, 2007 4:49 pm

http://www.smallgrin.net/random/2007042 ... _hires.mp4

Sorry, no 1080p for you :)
this is 320x180 but its a fair bit clearer, much higher bit rate.

Only 10MBs.

User avatar
optix
Posts: 393
Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2006 2:17 pm
Real Name: Rob K
Location: Bristol, UK

Post by optix » Wed Jun 20, 2007 3:49 pm

Deadman

Takes a deflection though.
I love this stupid game!

User avatar
Naked Snake
Posts: 984
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:04 pm
Real Name: Mark "I'm on the left" Williams
Location: Chicago

Post by Naked Snake » Wed Jun 20, 2007 4:32 pm

Nice shot. Looks like you have a lot of backlift though - I don't think I ever lift the foot above the level of the ball. This is probably slowing you down.

What does Rob Atha think, I wonder...?
Just Cup Them

User avatar
optix
Posts: 393
Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2006 2:17 pm
Real Name: Rob K
Location: Bristol, UK

Post by optix » Wed Jun 20, 2007 5:26 pm

Naked Snake wrote:Nice shot. Looks like you have a lot of backlift though - I don't think I ever lift the foot above the level of the ball. This is probably slowing you down.
Alas, it's not me...
I love this stupid game!

User avatar
Naked Snake
Posts: 984
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:04 pm
Real Name: Mark "I'm on the left" Williams
Location: Chicago

Post by Naked Snake » Wed Jun 20, 2007 9:58 pm

My bad. I take back that 'nice shot' then! It's a bit ridiculous if someone's gonna put up a vid like that and they can't hit a clean deadman!!

Nice camera work though.

Mark
Just Cup Them

User avatar
AK47
Posts: 469
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:13 am
Real Name: Antony Kay
Location: Bolton/Manchester

Post by AK47 » Tue Jun 26, 2007 5:32 pm

Am I the only one who finds these vids immaterial?

I prefer to see HOW the shot is performed by the wrist/hand/body position. I know what a Deadman shot is, how to spray a ball, what recoil looks like but without the technique in shot I can't see how it would help a novice improve their game to watch these videos.
Every Friday at Rileys Manchester on Deansgate. PM me for more info.

User avatar
Jonathan May
BFA Committee Observer
Posts: 3817
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:21 pm
Real Name: Jonathan May
Location: London
Contact:

Post by Jonathan May » Tue Jun 26, 2007 5:40 pm

AK wrote:Am I the only one who finds these vids immaterial?

I prefer to see HOW the shot is performed by the wrist/hand/body position. I know what a Deadman shot is, how to spray a ball, what recoil looks like but without the technique in shot I can't see how it would help a novice improve their game to watch these videos.
You are, of course, totally right.

Up until a certain point, a novice player will not know what is happening with the ball on the table - they won't understand exactly where it is going and what man is hitting it from what position etc. That is where THESE slo-mos are helpful.

Beyond that point they will want to know HOW by watching the hand/wrist (at the same time as you see what happens to the ball).

None of this is hard to do, it involves getting access to a camera and Rob Atha for about a day. You could film pretty much every shot and trick-shot and produce an incredibly useful high-quality foos tutorial.

Anyone have the time and/or inclination to do it? If you were to transfer IP rights to the BFA I think the BFA would consider purchasing it.

Best wishes

Jon

User avatar
tom_k
Site Administrator
Posts: 854
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2003 9:32 am
Real Name: Tom King
Location: Oxford

Post by tom_k » Tue Jun 26, 2007 9:26 pm

I was vaguely thinking of doing a sort of analysis of a snake defense etc - you could overlay the gaps with colour etc to show where the spaces are created etc;

To do the above, ie show the wrists and all, you'd ideally want two cameras though I reckon..

The Doctor
BFA Chairman
Posts: 1698
Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2003 5:41 pm
Real Name: Andrei Russell-Gebbett
Location: London

Post by The Doctor » Tue Jun 26, 2007 9:53 pm

Tom_K wrote:I was vaguely thinking of doing a sort of analysis of a snake defense... [fiendish computing task]
The above sounds like a job for Jon May - he's got lots of free time at the moment.  :D

As far as hand/wrist position goes, I think it's difficult to come up with anything useful beyond a) general advice that applies to everybody and b) specific advice that is tailored to individual players, once you've had a good look at their play. Each player has a different style, different stance, different size/shape of arm/hand etc.

With sth like a pin shot, I suspect that the 'ideal' wrist position also changes with context of play - ie where the ball is, hand/body position, immediate intentions etc. Add the abovementioned individual idiosyncracies and the whole thing becomes even more complicated.

PS That's why I haven't written anything for the pin shot 'how-to' - cos I can't make my mind up on the details.

User avatar
Jonathan May
BFA Committee Observer
Posts: 3817
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:21 pm
Real Name: Jonathan May
Location: London
Contact:

Post by Jonathan May » Tue Jun 26, 2007 10:04 pm

The Doctor wrote:The above sounds like a job for Jon May - he's got lots of free time at the moment.  :D
You are meant to be my friend, partner.

User avatar
AK47
Posts: 469
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:13 am
Real Name: Antony Kay
Location: Bolton/Manchester

Post by AK47 » Wed Jun 27, 2007 12:35 am

Andrei, whilst I agree everyone has different techniques, I think a generalisation of technique, body position, wrist-use would be helpful to a virgin.

Pause...

Resume...

After all, mastering the basics of any sport is the key to becoming a great player (I was reading somewhere on here the comparison between a pro snooker player and a fooser. Absolutely spot-on).

I agree with Jon that the absolute beginners of the game can view the vids on this site and understand how the ball and players are moving, but I ask the question would a true beginner know about this website anyway?! Most novices will have already understood the basic physics of the game before they find this site, and I think you'd agree, it IS a case of finding this site.

And I was thinking likewise with Tom_K: a multi-camera set-up would be essential for showing 'cause and effect'.

It would undoubtedly take some effort, but I feel it would be much more beneficial to the average rookie than the clips posted on here week-in week-out.
Every Friday at Rileys Manchester on Deansgate. PM me for more info.

User avatar
Bushy
Posts: 444
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 8:16 pm
Real Name: Adam Bushell
Location: Harrogate, North Yorkshire

Post by Bushy » Wed Jun 27, 2007 5:50 am

When i myself joined here still green behind the ears the hardest things to learn was how to stand,hold the bar,shift your weight and wether to wristflick or palm roll.
When i got to liverpool i spent my time asking for answers that are not shown explaned on any website and learnt so much.Of course when somebody is showing you in person you learn a lot quicker but i belive that video footage of shot/wrist stance is very important as all 3 gotogether to make a whole.
I personally think the tutorial side of this website showing shots ect needs a desperate revamp and having a demo of every pass/shot/defensive method though time consuming should see a larger amount of people picking the game up faster and feeling more comftable coming to an event.
my $0.2

The Doctor
BFA Chairman
Posts: 1698
Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2003 5:41 pm
Real Name: Andrei Russell-Gebbett
Location: London

Post by The Doctor » Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:33 am

AK wrote:After all, mastering the basics of any sport is the key to becoming a great player
Obv I agree, but in t-f's case, I would say the 'basics' to master are the basic movements of rod and ball.

For example, for a pull pin, the 'basics' would be to shift the ball towards you and then whack it in a straight line, whilst - crucially - keeping the ball running parallel to the rod. However, there are different ways to get this done - Chris Haddon can hit it wristy, some players palm roll with their thumb on the left hand side of the handle, others have their thumb resting on top with their fingers pointing up the handle, others 'cradle' the handle with their fingers.

Give players general indications and awareness of the full range of techniques that ppl use but emphasise that they've got to find what 'works for them.' They will find out what works for them by playing loads of matches while keeping the basic objectives for each shot in sight (eg 'keep the ball parallel to the rod when shooting pins').

Obv all this could be shown on the video too.
Last edited by The Doctor on Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:38 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Jonathan May
BFA Committee Observer
Posts: 3817
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:21 pm
Real Name: Jonathan May
Location: London
Contact:

Post by Jonathan May » Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:38 am

Since I can remember we've been having this discussion. It is definitely WORTH doing this. As yet no-one has been found who has actually got together the kit, the people, and the spare time. So there, I've thrown down the gauntlet, now get on with it!

Craig
Posts: 1309
Joined: Tue Mar 11, 2003 1:36 pm
Real Name: CF
Location: London

Post by Craig » Wed Jun 27, 2007 1:40 pm

Bushy wrote:green behind the ears
LOL  :lol:

User avatar
Jonathan May
BFA Committee Observer
Posts: 3817
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 5:21 pm
Real Name: Jonathan May
Location: London
Contact:

Post by Jonathan May » Wed Jun 27, 2007 1:58 pm

Craig, I'm surprised. I thought this was much funnier.
Bushy wrote:my $0.2

Craig
Posts: 1309
Joined: Tue Mar 11, 2003 1:36 pm
Real Name: CF
Location: London

Post by Craig » Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:14 pm

Didn't get that far.  LOL.   8)

User avatar
Naked Snake
Posts: 984
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2003 1:04 pm
Real Name: Mark "I'm on the left" Williams
Location: Chicago

Post by Naked Snake » Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:24 pm

Perhaps he is ten times as qualified to give opinions than the rest of us...
Just Cup Them

User avatar
Bushy
Posts: 444
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 8:16 pm
Real Name: Adam Bushell
Location: Harrogate, North Yorkshire

Post by Bushy » Wed Jun 27, 2007 9:56 pm

Jon May wrote:Craig, I'm surprised. I thought this was much funnier.
Bushy wrote:my $0.2
Correction $0.02
My 2 cents. Missed the extra decimal for those who care  :shock:

Post Reply